The purpose of this forum is to facilitate communication and mutual support and edification among those who strive toward gender justice in Churches of Christ. If you would like to join the forum, send an e-mail (including your first and last name) from your primary address to forum@gal328.org.
Please feel free to forward this information to interested candidates. Thank you.
Full-time Pulpit Minister opening at Cole Mill Road Church of Christ in Durham, NC.
Cole Mill Road Church of Christ is a loving, diverse congregation seeking to live and share the gospel in Durham, North Carolina and throughout the world. After 24 years of faithful service our pulpit minister will retire in June, 2007. During our worship, all sorts of people participate in the service—men and women, young and old. The Pulpit Minister should have at least 5-10 years of ministry experience. Salary and benefits are competitive. Additional information can be found at www.colemillrd.org
Minister Search Committee
Cole Mill Road Church of Christ
1617 Cole Mill Road
Durham, NC 27705
:::posted by NBeyer on 11/28/2006 08:30:00 PM
This is a great time to tell all you women out there who read this forum about Sally's conversations. They are intimate gatherings of 12 women. For three days you have time to talk through where we've been and where we're going and what is leadership. So good and so refreshing. I have been twice and would love to go again...even if the last time I went was just in September.
:::posted by julie on 11/26/2006 03:31:00 PM
Fred Peatross has chronicled an engaging interview with Sally Morgenthaler on the New Wineskins site: A Conversation with Sally Morgenthaler. It includes a short excerpt about female Christ-followers with leadership skills from her chapter in the book Emergent Manifesto of Hope. While she may not have the same roots as folks in Restoration churches, she has some perceptive and salient things to say!
(There was another interview with her (with John Ogren) about four years ago in New Wineskins ... it's nice to catch up with her again. BTW, all NW content is free through the holiday season - archives included.)
:::posted by Keith Brenton on 11/25/2006 07:44:00 PM
Bej -
I received such strong and encouraging support from D'Esta, and also from Katie Hays. I communicated with both of them via email in the midst of my struggles and trying to find my courage and my voice. I carry those emails in my Bible as constant reminders that I am not alone, because it is a journey and sometimes we slip, miss a step, and have to get up and try again. I later met D'Esta at a forum for elders/church leaders in the Dallas area. That's been several years now. I sat through her entire session on "Finding Your Calling" with tears rushing down my face. The hug she gave me later said, 'I know, and it's gonna be OK.' And it is. I am so privileged to be a part of the generation that is seeing God's full redemption for women coming to life in the Churches of Christ.
I look forward to the day when I see Katie face-to-face, and I can say to her, "Thank you for leading the way."
:::posted by Vicki on 11/20/2006 04:33:00 PM
To everyone,
Thank you so much for the words of support and encouragement. I would like to get over feeling as if I am doing something illicit or ill-advised by participating in this forum.
I recalled some time during the week that in the not too distant past (within the past year) I voiced to an elder in a rather quiet speculative way, "Do you ever wonder about the consequences of certain positions the church takes--the fact that if they are "wrong" [probably a loaded word I admit], that you might be losing people for Christ." He asked or said, as I recall, "For example." I said, "For example the position on women." [It was the first thing that came to my mind, even though I wasn't specifically thinking of the church's position on women at the time]. He said, "OH!, But, we're NOT wrong."
As far as my locale, I am in a very conservative region, but I best leave out the specifics.
For the person who commented on Episcopalianism, that was my childhood to early adulthood "religion." I've often speculated that it may be the non-generational church of Christ women who might have the most difficulty with the gender roles (by non-generational I mean being able to say "my daddy" and "my daddy's dad" were all church of Christ. Although some of the posts don't substantiate that.
I think my personal plan from this point will be to study and read as much as possible.
I actually initially came by the website and forum via D'Esta Love (!) although I did not sign up for the forum at the time. I had been to a ladies' session and the woman virtually ranted about the fact that some of the liberals on the West coast now even had women's ministers! That was news to me, so when I got free [and quickly associating "liberals on the West coast with Pepperdine] it wasn't minutes before I located D'Esta's name. I e-mailed her and she answered back, sending me the website link, and letting me know about the upcoming conferences on women in the ministry.
Anyway, I hope there aren't any moles participating in this website!
I think the main "problem" I have is that when I sit back, take a deep breath, and just think, what comes to mind is, "I can't believe that this is what Jesus wanted or wants" (silent women). But simply because I "believe" that doesn't convert it into inerrant scriptural truth--in fact, as I've indicated, the inerrant scriptural truth held in "these parts" is silence. Also, one has to learn to live with remarks such as this one I've collected for my files [which I'm still not "over" in that I think about it all the time]: "The TROUBLE with women having positions of authority in the society is that they then START FEELING THEIR OATS and think they can come into the church and have authority." Okay, run that by me again!
Also, it seems entirely analogical (?) to me, that the women issue should simply go the same way of the slavery issue. I can't understand why people just don't "see" that intuitively or instinctually almost, apart from any intellectual, hermeneutical dissection of the issue.
Thanks for the support and virtual hugs. GTG.
:::posted by Bej on 11/19/2006 06:07:00 PM
Bej,
As a not-so-young male in the CoC, I want to encourage you. Not everyone thinks that way. I believe we are approaching a tipping point, and that the change is going to happen rapidly in Churches of Christ. There will still be those who, through ignorance, stubbornness, honest belief, or a combination of the three, oppose that change, but they will become increasingly marginalized.
For now, consider my virtual arm around your shoulder, giving you encouragement as a daughter of the King.
:::posted by TWD on 11/14/2006 10:04:00 AM
I want to add my voice as an encouragement to Bej.
I knew years of crushing. Coming from a family of restorationists steeped deeply in a capella, every family gathering was an exercise in watching the males, no matter the age or ability to carry a tune, were encouraged to "lead" a song, while females were invisible, except as necessary for completing four-part harmony. I loved singing. I loved the harmony. I could sing every part. But I was invisible as a girl, as a young woman, and even as an older woman. I know the crushing of invisiblity.
As a CoC lifer @ 53, I am part of a CoC family, in the Heartland of small-town, rural America, that embraces and uses the gifts of all its members in all areas of church-life. We have been this way for several years now and it seems very strange - wrong - to visit a church that is all-male in its worship service. We could change the name on our building (and our neighboring CoC's wish that we would), but why should we? We are who and Whose we are, and we want to be here for all, incl. those of our fellowship who believe this teaching of silence to be wrong. For Christ-followers like you.
Change is not coming, change has arrived. It hasn't come because we sat silently on the sidelines. It has come because God has given us knowledge, given us our voices, and given us courage.
Be encouraged.
:::posted by Vicki on 11/12/2006 08:01:00 PM
Bej-
I think I know what you mean. I go to an Episcopal church now, but I remember sitting through church services where a man would pretend to lead singing even though he didn't know how while a woman would lead from her seat. When I was in high school, I was asked to read scripture for a ladies day and I was so thrilled. I was telling our minister how I had been chosen to do that and he said, "So what? That's no big deal." I was totally crushed. I could tell stories like that all day. Since I've started attending to the wounds that I received while in Churches of Christ, God has been sending so many former Church of Christ folks my way (many of them are Episcopalians now and many others are searching).
Several years ago, when I first found this site, I had some hope that things might change in Churches of Christ, but I kind of feel now that it won't happen for a long, long time. I am thankful that this site lead me to the Brookline Church of Christ where I was able to attend while living in Boston. Brookline gave me a chance to try many things that I had been barred from doing in the past. And it was really nice to take these first steps in a comfortable setting like what I was used to. I now read scripture and serve communion in my Episcopal parish and I felt kind of nervous when I started out because its all done differently than I had grown up with.
I hope that I'm not discouraging you. I think that God will send people your way right where you are to help you. That happened to me several times just when I needed it most. If you don't feel like posting publicly where you are then email one of the people whose addresses are listed on the site and I'm sure that they will work to hook you up with like-minded folks in your area.
:::posted by Indie on 11/11/2006 10:59:00 PM
Dear Bej, I am feeling for you. Where are you in school and can any of us help point you to places where you are that might help you feel joy and not crushed? We have all been there and if you read back through the archives, you will see that we have been through those same feelings. Please keep talking with us. Ask your college friends to join us also. We could use some healthy conversation on this forum.
:::posted by julie on 11/10/2006 11:10:00 PM
Does anyone ever feel simply crushed? We have this practice in chapel of going down the rows of those attending, and everyone either gets to lead a song, or read a "favorite" Bible passage to the group. That is if you are a male. It seems so "strange" to me that I totally lose any voice once I cross the boundary between campus and church. It bothers me as well because many of the males don't really read that well, or they could care less, while it would be very meaningful for me. The other day some people were talking in the break room about a church that had let a woman read some sort of "part" in front of the congregation, as part of a group of people, possibly doing some sort of "skit." The details were really vague. After some discussion among the men and women present about this, one of the younger men spoke up rather emphatically and said, "Why are we/you even talking about this. I JUST don't see where it could EVER become an issue that a woman should read ANYTHING in front of the congregation." Meaning that to him, the issue was set in such unexaminable steadfast concrete, that it was apparently ignorant and stupid for us to even be talking about it. I apologize if this is old hat territory for this forum, in that maybe everyone here is examining higher level issues. When I heard such a very, very young male--with the future of the/my church in his hands--express such clear disdain for even examining the issue of gender hierarchy or inequity, I felt utterly hopeless about any dialogue whatsoever.
:::posted by Bej on 11/10/2006 09:28:00 PM
Laura Coulter is an occasional contributor to my favorite journal, PRISM, a bi-monthly published for members of Evangelicals for Social Action or, as in my case, an affiliated organization. The journal notes that she is an "Alabama-based writer" or "based in Birmingham."
So, assuming that this speaker is the same person whose writings I have read, Laura Coulter is a champion of all kinds of causes for social justice and a wonderful advocate for the poor and oppressed. Her most recent contribution was in the July/August 2006 issue and entitled, "Connecting With the Struggle." It is the record of an interview with an attorney who "seeks justice for indigent prisoners on Alabama's death row." Other pieces in recent years have addressed issues of water scarcity on the continent of Africa as well as in other parts of the world (May/June 2005), a piece entitled, "Juvenile Injustice" (November/December 2004), a piece on political detainees entitled, "The Least of These" (July/August 2004), a piece on gender justice in the church entitled, "Using the 'F' Word" (May/June 2004), and "Annunciation," a poem about Love and squalor (January/February 2002).
--David Fritz
:::posted by Fritz on 11/07/2006 01:53:00 PM
Hugh Rushing, a member at Cahaba Valley, wrote the forum to say the sermon Mark referred to was delivered by Laura Coulter, the church's Children's and Family Minister.
Katie's sermons can be heard in MP3 format via her church's website. The website can be found here.
-
:::posted by jch on 11/06/2006 09:28:00 PM
You can go to www.cahabavalley.org and click on "Audio" and then click on the sermon for October 29, 2006, and you should be able to hear the sermon I was referring to. Hope that works for you.
:::posted by Mark on 11/03/2006 09:47:00 PM
Mark,
Do you have URLs for those podcasts?
Thanks
:::posted by TWD on 11/03/2006 11:22:00 AM
I recently downloaded and listened to a Podcast of a woman who spoke at Cahaba Valley not long ago. I don't know her name, but she did a great job. I am delighted to hear of the new elder there.
And I am also a regular listener to Katie Hays's sermons, via the wonder of the internet, and I recommend them highly to everybody I know.
Do any other readers of this blog have similar recommendations of good speakers that you listen to?
:::posted by Mark on 11/02/2006 09:05:00 PM
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