The purpose of this forum is to facilitate communication and mutual support and edification among those who strive toward gender justice in Churches of Christ. If you would like to join the forum, send an e-mail (including your first and last name) from your primary address to forum@gal328.org.
The forum has been quiet lately. But some of you may be interested in reading about a study under way at ACU on issues of attracting and supporting women faculty members at Church of Christ-related colleges and universities. For information, point your browsers to
http://www.acu.edu/academics/cbs/newsletter/200311.html#women.
Meanwhile, would anyone here care to comment on what difference it has made in your education that you had (or did not have) women teachers in your major field of study?
--Chris
:::posted by Christopher on 10/30/2003 04:30:09 PM
Received this note from a friend at Highland CoC in Abilene. Thought y'all might be interested in what it said.
Just thought you'd like to know that starting at some point this month Highland will be having women serve communion and read scripture in the assembly!
As you probably know, they did that very in-depth study of women's roles, and the elders announced at the end that they concluded that the Bible did call for an increased role of women in the public assembly and that changes would be implemented accordingly (gradually). The first change, which took place several months (or maybe even a year) ago was having women make announcements and sing solos during special music times. We just got a letter from the elders last week announcing that the next phase of implementation would start in the next month or so and would include women serving communion and reading scripture.
Anyway, I knew you would be rejoicing with us, so I wanted to share!
I've been encouraging my friend to come over here when she has some time but she is a fairly busy young lady these days working for ACU!
ACU homecoming tomorrow!!!!!
Grace and peace to all. Wiley
:::posted by Wiley on 10/25/2003 12:43:01 AM
Since Patty buried her comment about our ministry opportunity in her post, I thought that I'd add a couple of more details. I know that we're not (yet) fully inclusive, but things are looking hopeful for someone who would be willing to work with a congregation that is feeling its way toward something like that. And to give Patty's comments a bit more positive context, the one egalitarian elder is only 1 of 3 active elders and at least one of the others seems flexible since his daughter has started heading that way. I'm not that sure about the 3rd elder, but he doesn't come across as a towering dogmatic. We do have an inactive 4th elder who is opposed, but still, it seems to be a good groundwork.
Finally, two other guys and myself will be teaching a hermeneutics/gender issues class starting in December that is shaping up nicely. We're comparing three different hermeneutical methods (including the tradtional C of C style) and practicing applying them to various issues with a focus on gender. One of the new styles demands at minimum a near gender justice and potentially a full blown version. The other new style also seems open to it although it seems to say that not doing so might just make us less effective whereas the first hermeneutic implies that not pushing gender is actually falling short of God's design.
One part of the body to the other,
--Jason
:::posted by Jason on 10/21/2003 09:40:42 AM
I've been thinking all day about posting here so here I am.
I was listening to the latest Zoe CD that I got this weekend. In the song "Days of Elijah" the group repeats the phrase "There's no God like Jehovah" over and over. My husband and I have been reading through the bible and we are in the begining of Deuteronomy right now and it really struck me just how awesome our God, Jehovah is. How unlike the gods that others serve he is and how indebted to him I am. Perhaps it is just the pregnancy hormones gone rampant but I found myself crying in my car this morning just overwhelmed with the Goodness of God. At other times I have found repeated phrases like that anoying but I didn't want to come to the end of that passage. I felt like I could keep singing that same phrase over and over for the rest of my life and never get tired of it. I may be the only one who is struck by that song in that manner but perhaps it can be a source of renewal to someone else here like it was for me this morning.
Also, I have been needing to let the members here know that our congregation is engaged in an official minister search. Although we are not at this point a gender just group there is a significant portion (including one elder) who are trying to move the congregation in that direction. Also, at least 2 members of the minister search comittee are definatly looking for a minister who supports gender justice. The web site to read about it is here. http://www.midcounty.org/?section=11 Please pass this along to anyone that you can think of who may be suitable. I wish it was a position open to both genders but one thing at a time.
Patty
:::posted by Patty on 10/20/2003 10:55:56 PM
Greetings to you all,
The picture is my daughter, Ann and my grandson. What a sweet moment that was!
I just had an interesting memory looking at the picture.
When I was a girl the minister of the local congregation baptized me. There was no thought that anyone else would.
When Ann was a girl, her father bapized her. There was no thought that anyone else would.
When my grandson was baptized, his mother baptized him. There was no thought that anyone else would.
I don't know what that thought means, but it is an intersesting progression.
God is good.
Sue
:::posted by Sue on 10/18/2003 09:54:48 AM
Ann, the picture is beautiful! Praise God from whom all blessings flow!
Joe
:::posted by jch on 10/17/2003 09:18:29 AM
Yeah, Ann! I'm happy for you and your son, sister.
-Tom
:::posted by TWD on 10/16/2003 06:50:41 PM
Here's the picture Julie mentioned:
:::posted by Lance on 10/16/2003 01:10:35 PM
Julie,
You can send the pic to me. I'll post it.
:::posted by Lance on 10/14/2003 07:25:20 PM
Katie:
Thanks for the news about Rita. She was such an inspiration and steady presence during our years at Brookline. So many people who blindly oppose gender justice from a distance assume a very negative stereotype about those who call for it. Rita does not conform to those stereotypical assumptions but simply lives the life of a Christian woman, contributing fully to the life of her church both in and out of worship "in full assurance of faith." I look forward to the day when women like her will be the rule rather than the exception.
Tim
:::posted by Tim on 10/14/2003 11:28:39 AM
Hey, can anyone out there...Joe?, Lance?, Katie? tell me if we can post pictures here on this forum? Ann's dad just sent me a great picture of Ann baptizing her son and it would a great picture to share here. Just wondering. grace, Julie
:::posted by julie on 10/13/2003 10:30:46 PM
Thanks for telling us Katie. The first time I went to Brookline Rita read a scripture during the service. It was the first time that I had ever seen a woman participating in a Church of Christ in that way.
:::posted by Indie on 10/12/2003 04:07:44 PM
This weekend Lance and I, along with several church leaders from my congregation, traveled to Burlington, Massachusetts for a convocation of Church of Christ folks from the New England states (with a few New Yorkers thrown in for good measure). The event is called "Conversation 2003" and we enjoyed several fine speakers: Richard Hughes, John York, Paul Clark, and Christopher Green.
Each year the Conversation planners honor several sisters and brothers who have been important in the lives of these mostly small, isolated congregations in New England. This year, the Brookline Church honored Rita Early, an elderly native Bostonian whose 50-year participation in that congregation has been invaluable. Upon receiving her plaque, Rita said to the crowd,
"I can't believe it. This is the first time I've ever been just me. I'm just me. I've always been somebody's wife, somebody's mother, somebody's grandmother. But now, for the first time, I'm just me. Thank you. Thank you so much."
peace -- Katie
:::posted by Katie on 10/12/2003 06:56:17 AM
Hello Everyone! I needed to hear your "voices" so I read back 50 posts or so. Thanks. Thanks too for the new voices. The Collective is growing! ... and evolving! I agree that church planting is the most effective solution. It is unorthodox for the COC to perpetuate health rather than aggressively treat the affliction regardless of the collatoral damage. But Wiley can tell you that I usually choose the alternative path (voted Green Party in the recall :), and church planting to perpetuate the gender-inclusive truth of the gospel of Jesus rather than the same old agonizing debates and baby-stepping is refreshing! The reason we take baby-steps is so that we can get back to mama real quick the moment we are startled at that big scary world out there. Church planting is preventative too, since gender-justice can be taught more comprehensively than it would probably be possible to teach in a battle-scarred church. I believe the truth will set you free, and by teaching all of it ... the history, the various doctrines with objectivity and discipline ... the results will be fruitful and enduring. I can't even imagine this happening in any COC I have ever attended. We need new ones. And new universities while we're at it.
I have been too busy away from home to access the internet lately, but I have been reading quite a bit. My book club just finished Honeymoon in Purdah (a lovely book for those interested in Middle East women's studies) and Confessions of a Pagan Nun (a wild fictional romp with some 4th century feminist Druids through the Augustine-Pelagius controversy) and The DaVinci Code (a Hollywoodish extravaganza of Indiana Jones meets radical biblical-feminism, and I say, "Take your medicine church. If you avoid talking about stuff, it will be discussed without you") and I will pick up my copy of "The Power of Partnership" by Eisler tomorrow. The discussions have been great! I wish you could hear them. I've been taking my trusty Tillich "The History of Christian Thought" along for reference and some of the women have purchased one of their own. I just think it's interesting that the club has gone in this direction (sign of the times?)
Anyway ... I've missed all of you. I can't be here as much these days, but you are all in my thoughts and prayers.
Carmen
:::posted by Carmen on 10/10/2003 02:29:00 AM
Hi friends, so good to meet all of you...Laura, Joe, Sophie, Chad, Tom...I hope I didn't miss anyone. I was feeling miserable most of the weekend and felt like I was walking in a fog. Sorry if my conversations were disjointed and I looked zoned out. Laura and I were able to spend more time together and what a precious woman she is! I would love some more time with you when I am more myself. We don't all live very far apart...the group that was at Zoe are very close...Maryland, New York and Massachusetts. I regretted not going out to dinner together one night...I wanted more time. I met Chad right before he was leaving. Joe give us more of your thoughts on Zoe...You know that John York disagreed with what had been before and said so during his sessions in the worship conference. I was very tired and sick and probably to John York looked like I was napping but I think I caught most of what he was saying and we were on the same wavelength. Too embarrassed to go up after and talk with him...yeah, I was the woman in the back who was taking a nap but great class. Other interesting conflict in the worship ministers track. That is another story. grace, Julie
:::posted by julie on 10/08/2003 10:35:59 PM
It was great to finally meet some of y'all at the Zoe Conference. I can now put a face to your blogs. The Zoe conference was good but I was incredibly disappointed to hear a leader within our tradition tell a room full of willing listeners that women were allowed to do everything but be an elder, preach or lead prayer in Sunday worship. Upon hearing that I cringed (and almost vomitted) as I watched the hearers soak in what the leader said. It reinforced the old bit of wisdom that change will come from the pews or layfolk (from below), not from those in leadership positions (from above). Which means it is all the more important for us to continually turn folks on to this site and challenge the mainstream way of thinking about gender justice!
:::posted by jch on 10/07/2003 11:20:56 AM
Carolyn, welcome to this forum.
Since my mother comes from western Kentucky, I have visited there many times and am familiar with the climate. I love the people of Kentucky, but you are in the "buckle" of the Bible Belt.
I'd start out visiting congregations located near university campuses, e.g., places such as Madisonville. I suspect you might find more receptive ears in those settings. Perhaps you could recommend a study group on gender issues.
Another option would be to visit other churches that already practice gender justice. If you don't have objection to instrumental music, the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ) usually has shared leadership between men and women. I have attended First Christian Church in Greenville (Muhlenberg County) and found that they do have women elders and deacons. Following is a listing of DoC web sites in Kentucky. If you surf some of these pages, you'll get a sense of women's involvement in each local church:
http://www.disciples.org/internal/resources/congwebka2oh.htm#KENTUCKY
A third idea--which would require a lot of energy--would be to start your own fellowship. If you advertised in the community, I bet you would find people who are seeking the same thing as yourself.
Whatever you decide to do, please stand up for what you believe in. You may be the "pioneer" that is needed in your community. Good luck!
:::posted by R. Kirk on 10/07/2003 12:40:18 AM
We've just posted a new article by Chris Hutson. Take a look:
A Study Guide to 1 Timothy 2:8-15
:::posted by Lance on 10/02/2003 06:34:43 PM
Carolyn,
I don't think you're close enough to worship there regularly, but you might contact the Southside Church of Christ in Lexington. This congregation sponsors a campus ministry at the U. of Kentucky. The minister and elders there are at least open to exploring gender questions, and they might be able to help you find other likeminded folks closer to your new home. Their web site is:
http://www.southsidechurchofchrist.org/Default.cfm.
Grace be with you,
Chris
:::posted by Christopher on 10/02/2003 03:34:35 PM
Sarah,
For a historical perspective on the question of women baptizing in the Restoration Movement, see Matthias Winans, "Letter to the Editors of the Christian Messenger" 7 (1833), which is available with introduction and commentary on Hans Rollmann's "Restoration Movement Homepage." Point your browser to:
http://www.mun.ca/rels/restmov/texts/rmwomen/women1.html.
This won't settle the question, but it will provide food for thought about our spiritual ancestors' views on the topic.
Brotherly,
Chris
:::posted by Christopher on 10/02/2003 03:22:16 PM
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